Ukraine vs Russia military by the numbers

  1. Whats with the key? Just one example, if the tanks represent 500 each and Ukraine has just under 2,500 why does it only use 2 tanks to represent that? Shouldn't it be 4 or 5??

  2. Yea there’s some misrepresentations all over. Kind of questioning the legitimacy of the numbers. I’ll do some research.

  3. Tanks, AFVs, and artillery should all be listed as 1,000 each instead of 500. Besides that, the image is mostly correct, except it rounded up one Russian artillery when it should have rounded down, and inexplicably shorted 3 Ukrainian AFVs.

  4. Countries like China and Russia never say what they actually have. Both claim they don’t spend that much on military but we all know that isn’t true.

  5. The real kicker is that Ukraine has far far far less territory to protect than Russia does. Plus It's not as if Russia's entire military can attack Ukraine all at once.

  6. Ukraine could never win a war against Russia, but Ukraine [can] make the cost of invading them high enough, that it’s not worth it.

  7. Especially since Russia's population reportedly doesn't support this invasion much and has a light stomach for casualties. Especially amongst young generations, which is the military age.

  8. The Finns defeated Stalin during the Winter war. They lost 10% of their population but David can defeat Goliath.

  9. No, it will be worth it. This is precisely why Germany's naval commander resigned. What you're hoping from your perspective is called a "pyrric victory", but this isn't medieval warfare. If this plays out and Russia wins this very easy fight, they'll have the morale, momentum, positioning, and support to push further into Europe. Since Europe is naturally divided outside of NATO resolve, Putin could do to Europe what Hitler did less then a century ago. The major difference is that Putin has the temperament to keep what he takes.

  10. I believe this would work against a nation that makes war purely for economic reasons, like the USA and other nations absolutely structured through capitalism. But Russia? Russia doesn't want to open markets, nor would it go into it just for the resources that Ukraine has, that's a bonus. Russia enters into it for power, for political influence through force, to intimidate. It's a nation driven by a centralizing, nationalist and militaristic policy, a war against a neighboring nation is just flexing your muscles and saying "This side of the world is our zone of influence, no one touches our backyard with impunity". Being expensive financially wouldn't change anything...

  11. Yes, we can. Last 8 years already proved this statement considering that in 2014 we even doesn't have regular army by any mean.

  12. Reality might be even closer for Ukraine. While those numbers for Russia might be accurate, not all those vehicles are in fighting condition.

  13. Within the current context, it's even less lopsided. Russian has mobilised 120,000 troops on the border. Not 3 million. Whatever happens, they will want to keep troops and equipment across Russia.

  14. Plus you get an extra 5 armies if you can hold the rest of europe! Personally always started in Australia or South America and worked my way up from there. Until one of my uncles would inevitably get mad and trash the whole board.

  15. Ikr, the tanks are worth 500 each and for some reason, Ukraine only has 2 despite it having passed the 2000 mark.

  16. Right? 1 ship figure = 13 Russia has 9 figures, 9*13=117 but Russia has 214? It isn't even consistent in their arbitrary scale

  17. Numbers don't matter, it's not 1939 anymore. War doesn't look like that, did you see great armies of Russia marching into Crimea few years ago? No. So don't expect it now.

  18. Cool. Now show a comparison of the Ukraine forces vs. the Russian forces that are actually in position to invade Ukraine. It’s not like Russia will use 100% of their forces to invade. This isn’t a game of RISK.

  19. If it was a game of risk, it would also be a pretty poor strategy to bring all your troops to invade one region that is not a bottleneck!

  20. This. Also only about third of those forces on both sides are in operational condition with Russia at a disadvantage operating away from its bases. They’re also at a disadvantage when it comes to sustainment. Russia still overpowers Ukraine but not as drastically as the graphic suggests. It will not be an easy war for them.

  21. This is misleading because 1) Russia would use only a small part of its military resources in Ukraine, whereas Ukraine would use all to defend; and 2) Ukrainians would be fully committed to the fight, whereas Russian soldiers want no part of it and morale would be a huge issue.

  22. I’m not so sure about that. Russia is very good at propoganda, and they’ve been indoctrinating/ tricking their people (and others) rather well since Putin took over.

  23. It’s hard to compare the US fighting wars on the other side of the world to Russia fighting it’s neighbour. They would have a much easier and cheaper time refitting and resupplying than the US had shipping so many troops and equipment so far away.

  24. That was different. Usa wouldn't have any problem stemrolling over vietnam if it was on its border Proxy war on other hand is far more difficult. Look what Germany did in ridiculous short amount of time in Europe during ww2.

  25. Keep in mind that these numbers may not be representative of the actual numbers on the front. For example, Russia has 214 ships yes, but only a fraction of those are in the Black Sea. Moreover, Russia can't deploy ALL of its forces against Ukraine at once.

  26. Furthermore, Russia is broke, economically hamstrung, and has limited logistics capabilities to support an offensive, so their ability to project force is necessarily limited. For all we know, those 100-150k troops they're massing near Ukraine are the extent of what they could project and support.

  27. Dozens of thousands of modernized Igla and Strela MANPADS, some (not disclose publically) amount of SA-13 Gopher , same with SA-15 Gauntlet, but at least 6, as 6 of them were used in parade in 2018, same with ЗСУ-23-4, many are being modernized with AESA being installed, 75 SA-19 Grison, 71 SA-11 Gadfly, 250 SA-10 Grumble all according to wiki+ an unknown amount of SA-3 Goa modernized to "с-125-2д "печора-2д" level, basically a completely different, modern system

  28. How many friends? I'm guessing Ukraine has some pretty tough friends, now that Russia's useful idiot across the Atlantic is no longer in charge.

  29. This is very misleading since russia for instance has its country divided into certain military responsibility regions (south,west,north, east).

  30. 100% correct. But reddit is like 90% teens and 20 somethings that like cool pointless as shit graphics. Russia would missile, bomb and drone strike the living fuck out of their military assets before even setting foot in the country.

  31. It's mostly "Russian separatist terrorists" who are really just picked up from the street as 18-19 year old from the mining communities in the east and like, here's some money and a gun go shoot some Ukrainian officers..

  32. My worry is if Europe and the US get involved, will China as well. I still feel if it came down to it the US and Europe could take China and Russia, but effectively all sides lose.

  33. Most of these means are outdated. The question is who has more hypersonic drones? Who has better flak and AMS? How up to date is the atillery?

  34. Because they never cared. They still cannot mentally recover from the fact that USSR failed. They see Eastern Europe as theirs and cannot accept the fact that they it’s not. Those imperialist tendencies have driven the country for centuries. Eventually it will destroy them, hopefully soon enough because I am honestly sick and tired of that wretched country (speaking of government and government supporters, ordinary citizens are innocent as long as they don’t support this circus)

  35. Money can't buy you a victory, but being friends with the USA friends can. Just look at Israel.

  36. This reminds me of that one recording of Hitler shoulder deep in a war started with Russia and being flabbergasted how his army spotted 35,000 Russian tanks, and at one point confirmed destroyed 34,000 yet each factory they come across employed 30K to 60K of slave condition people each pumping out 3,000 to 6,000 tanks on some absurd schedule.

  37. It’s something Russians are pretty damned proud of. At that point in the war, an analogous territory from the East Coast to Chicago was burned to the ground. A bunch of farmers in Wisconsin began to pump out tanks so well and so frequently that they pushed the enemy back.

  38. Germany was well aware that Russia had more resources before they invaded but they believed their resources were inferior to Germany's as they were able to inspect Russian tanks and vehicles after the war with Finland.

  39. Stalingrad the tanks literally rolled off the lines from factories in the city, and to the front line. Some without all the guns and or sights on them. When Germany finally captured the factories they were still in there building tanks.

  40. Hilter's plan was to exterminate the eastern slavs so they gave it their best effort to not die. Turns out it's a pretty good motivator.

  41. The graphic would have been better if the data matched the key. For example, if one copter represents 25 copters, 13 copters should be shown has an image of half a copter. Redo it right OP

  42. Yeah, but the entire Ukrainian force will be at the battle, while Russia needs to leave part of its army defending other fronts.

  43. I live in Russia and don't feel comfortable about everybody talking how Russia is going to a war with Ukraine. My live is pretty shitty already.

  44. As a Russian... People, can you please stop fantasizing and speculating about this war? I understand that for most of you it's some banana republic conflict happening beyond the ocean, which you can observe with a bucket of popcorn. You have no idea how much pain it inflicts on both nations. Nobody wants this war. Nobody in the their right mind will flip the switch and start it. This troops-gathering is nothing but showing teeth, provoking the world leaders into playing nonsensical and outdated geopolitical games, all inspired by some esoterical KGB doctrines that our obviously detached "dear leader" was raised on. This attention and speculation is all he needs to feel important and relatable in the world's politics, and he's winning!

  45. The world is under no illusion that Ukraine has done anything to start or escalate tensions. This is solely upon Russia's posturing. We all hope it's just that.

  46. I remember hearing that Putin's approval rate rose tremendously after annexing Crimea. Why wouldn't he try pulling the same move again? People are right to believe that this is more than just a show.

  47. I think the general feeling is concern. Nobody I know wants this to happen. We’re just concerned because every day we hear more reports that suggest war is coming.

  48. Look at the numbers in Croatia's defence against Jugoslav army in Serbia's hands, or what damage Partisans did to Nazis, or what fat Ls America have took in wars and you'll see that defenders have much more heart in battles, they have more to lose, they have more reasons to die for

  49. I’m not disagreeing with you, but having heart, in a war, doesn’t mean much. For your America example, they could’ve went said “fuck it” and flattened Vietnam or Afghanistan. They have the equipment, the training, and “heart” wouldn’t be enough to stop that. Only reason they didn’t, is because they aren’t like 1930-45 Germany, and don’t want to have a mass # of civilians killed in order to “win”. Sometimes it’s not worth it, sometimes it is. This war could easily become one of those “fuck it” wars for Russia, which wouldn’t be good for Ukraine.

  50. This is so deceptive, just look at armored vehicles. Each for Ukraine represents 1300ish and for Russia each represents 1000ish. Such a poor chart.

  51. Imagine what us earthlings could accomplish if we spent our resources on helping eachother vs spend it on individual countries military.

  52. Someone there would love to see russia and ukraine in war. Dont be stupid people, they will make profit and sell guns while sitting in their huge mansions while you die like sheeps. Know your tue enemy...

  53. Ukraine had an obscenely corrupt pro-russian government until a western supported colour revolution in 2014. Almost immediately after this fighting began along the Russian border by 'ethnic russians' supported by Russian troops (posing as volunteers), and Russia later annexed Crimea, which went smoothly as many crimeans identified as russian anyway and it was already part of Russia until 1954, when it was transferred to the Ukrainian SSR for practical reasons.

  54. Definitely not a cool guide here Who the heck thinks anything remotely related to human being dying is cool? Any additional conflict in that region will be a loss for all of us - humans

  55. And yet the Russian people will be forced to swallow unbelievable losses, yet again, if their Neanderthal inbred leaders attempt such a doomed conflict.

  56. Even if they manage to "win", they'll be so riddled with sanctions that the already miserable Russian economy will enter a new phase of misery.

  57. Surface to surface and middle defense would be a couple of key components. I also think (not positive) that Ukraine have a lot of pro Russia insiders

  58. For an invasion of Ukraine, imminent or long term, the invasion of Crimea makes sense geographically and as a region is the path of least resistance due to Russian ethnic majority

  59. Ukraine can mobilize all 1 million of their active troops, plus any civilians. Russia has a pool of 3 million to draw from, but they cannot count on half of those being able to be used in Ukraine as many are diverted and stationed through the rest of the country. Russia has significantly more soldiers and equipment, but with the right leadership and in drawing out the fight, Ukraine has a good shot on their own.

  60. No high-voted comments pointing out the thousands of shoulder-mounted missiles that are flooding into Ukraine.... these will put some hurt on Russian armor and helicopters. Not sure if they can reach fighters.

  61. The irony of Russia claiming they don't want NATO on its boarder is that invading Ukraine will ensure that NATO will be on their border.

  62. Just remember Finland, Afghanistan & Chechnya and that's just Russia there are conflicts around the world that have shown it's harder to invade than it is to defend. Russia will invade Ukraine but its important for Ukraine to wage a gorilla war once it does happen, the west is too preoccupied with Ukraine fighting a war how they want the Ukraine to fight Russia, Ukraine should fight a war how they believe they can win. Putin is getting older and weaker he wants a legacy, all dictatorships want that, but Russia must ask itself when Putin will dies what type of Russia does it want to be.

  63. The armored vehicles scale being so off makes me mistrust the graphical representation of the other fields. In addition, since Russia is a gigantic country, it would be interesting to see Ukraine vs Russian assets within X distance of the border.

  64. This means nothing, modern warfare is all about drone capabilities. Azerbaijan just wiped out Armenians army in 2 week with cheep drones aquired from Turkey. Drones are the new stones that kill Goliaths.

  65. To address something about the troops - Russia’s soldiers are conscripted, embittered, and treated like shit. Ukraine’s soldiers are free men fighting for their homeland. And I would think a lot of Russia’s soldiers will likely desert before putting their life at risk.

  66. If they did fight it'd just be a massive drawn out fight, it's not like russia is going to be able to line up their 13,000 tanks against ukraines 2,500 and have a shoot out. It'd be a disaster for russia even if they won because economically they'd be fucked.

  67. If i remember this correctly and i may not, ukraine after USSR dissolved had 3rd largest arsenal of nuclear weapons but russian federation made a deal, give us the nukes and we will never ever invade you. Edit: i just fact checked this and it was correct ukraine had about 3000 nuclear warheads

  68. Three things not listed her in Ukraine's favour: (1) Russia can't possibly use all this stuff against the Ukraine, they would only use a small portion of it (2) Ukraine has hundreds/thousands of ATGMs, including Javelins, stinger and NLAWs (3) Ukraine has 20/30 Turkish drones, and a bunhc of smaller ones drones wiped out an entire offensive by themselves in Syria, and won the war for Azerbaijan.

  69. They could basically just get rid of all the graphics on this chart. Most of the graphics don't symbolize anything.

  70. Everyone saying Ukraine has a chance is utterly deluded. Russia’s overwhelming air superiority will end this instantly. The Ukrainians will not be able to do anything with Russian air supremacy. You can’t move tank battalions around if they just get bombed. You can’t defend a hard point if it just gets bombed. Ukraine’s SAM network is not strong enough to contain the Russian threat and will just get destroyed by SEAD very early in.

  71. And Europe would fucking trounce Russia, spank Putin like a chastised child, and throw them back over the Ural. If they'd they only grow a fucking pair.

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